Thank You Paul Setzer, Wherever You May Be

[Mr Twangy]

I wasn't around on this forum when Paul Setzer was active but he must have been a remarkable individual because this guide that he created is magic when it comes to setting the pole pieces on Blacktop Filter'trons. It balanced my pickups in a way that I never would have stumbled on in a year of fiddling. Thank you Mr. Setzer wherever you are now.

 

[Viking Power]

Having just done my first setup, this opens up more questions for me. Haha. I set mine up to follow the radius of the fretboard or thereabouts.

 

[Mr Twangy]

I hear ya. What I like about this is that to my ears it balances the strings and the two pickups better, even though intuitively it doesn't look like it would. Some kind of voodoo going on. But stick with what you have if it sounds right. The only other suggestion you'll get often is "Just do it by ear, it's not rocket science", only I think it sort of is 'rocket science' or psychacoustic physics of some sort. I only know if I try to do it by ear, I don't know where the starting point is and I'll be adjusting pole pieces endlessly going around in circles.

 

[SAguitar]

Thank you, Mr. Setzer! I find this very interesting. Over the years, after a lot of just adjusting the poles to my ears, I have come to set most of my pickups like the above illustration (for the unwound G). I still tweak them pole pieces a bit over time but I seem to have come up with the same pattern by my own devise.

 

[Emergence]

Having just done my first setup, this opens up more questions for me. Haha. I set mine up to follow the radius of the fretboard or thereabouts.

Following the radius is just the starting point. It’s actually more complicated than Paul Setzer’s illustration indicates. Timbre changes with technique. Unwound strings are brighter plucked with the long fingers than rubbed across with the thumb. This is one good reason to use a wound third string. Timbre is more even between strings when playing with a pick. The high E string is sometimes less loud than the other strings. Raising its pole piece is one way to compensate. The low E can sound farty on some guitars, especially when with humbuckers. Raising the pole piece and picking that string less aggressively can compensate.

There’s no such thing as perfect setup. Either tell your story to an experienced luthier or learn how each adjustment changes sound, timbre, and playability and learn to do it yourself. The good thing is that most everything short of fret leveling and crowning is easily reversible. Additionally, different guitars require subtle differences in setup and the differences are not just between brands, but between different models with the same name on the headstock too.

 

[drmilktruck]

What's up with Paul? (There was a rumor several years ago that he had died but it turned out to be another Paul Setzer from North Carolina.) His work is great.

 

[Henry]

If Paul is @Setzerhotrod, he appears to have last posted in November.

 

[drmilktruck]

If Paul is @Setzerhotrod, he appears to have last posted in November.

Not the same person. Paul’s screen name was just Setzer. I don’t see that in the list of members.

 

[ForTheLoveOfIvy]

I believe it is a diagram for Dynasonics but I'm sure it applies to most pickups. I think he had a different diagram for Filtertrons if I remember correctly.

 

[Mr Twangy]

I believe it is a diagram for Dynasonics but I'm sure it applies to most pickups. I think he had a different diagram for Filtertrons if I remember correctly.

I believe it is a diagram for Dynasonics but I'm sure it applies to most pickups. I think he had a different diagram for Filtertrons if I remember correctly.

But Dynasonics have studs spaced to more or less follow string path, with adjustable pole pieces above/below the studs but spaced tighter in groups of two, whereas the Setzer diagram appears to show adjustable pole pieces spaced as they are on a filtertron.

 

[ForTheLoveOfIvy]

But Dynasonics have studs spaced to more or less follow string path, with adjustable pole pieces above/below the studs but spaced tighter in groups of two, whereas the Setzer diagram appears to show adjustable pole pieces spaced as they are on a filtertron.

Dynasonics just have 6 single slug magnets as pole pieces, the little screws adjacent to them are for adjusting the height of each slug. I believe this diagram is simply showing the slug magnets. I might be wrong and this diagram is for Filtertrons but this looks a lot like Paul Setzer’s diagram for Dynas.

 

[Mr Twangy]

Dynasonics just have 6 single slug magnets as pole pieces, the little screws adjacent to them are for adjusting the height of each slug. I believe this diagram is simply showing the slug magnets. I might be wrong and this diagram is for Filtertrons but this looks a lot like Paul Setzer’s diagram for Dynas.

Of course, I see it now. Well, you may be right then!

 

[Viking Power]

Following the radius is just the starting point. It’s actually more complicated than Paul Setzer’s illustration indicates. Timbre changes with technique. Unwound strings are brighter plucked with the long fingers than rubbed across with the thumb. This is one good reason to use a wound third string. Timbre is more even between strings when playing with a pick. The high E string is sometimes less loud than the other strings. Raising its pole piece is one way to compensate. The low E can sound farty on some guitars, especially when with humbuckers. Raising the pole piece and picking that string less aggressively can compensate.

There’s no such thing as perfect setup. Either tell your story to an experienced luthier or learn how each adjustment changes sound, timbre, and playability and learn to do it yourself. The good thing is that most everything short of fret leveling and crowning is easily reversible. Additionally, different guitars require subtle differences in setup and the differences are not just between brands, but between different models with the same name on the headstock too.

Thanks for the detailed reply. Great food for thought for someone like me trying to learn.

 

[TV the Wired Turtle]

pole positiont is def. important for string balance but there is a starting point to get you across the proper finish line:

you still have to get your filtertron up to a benchmark height to adjust for the proper output that a filtertron needs for proper output response.
The 3/16" from top of filter cover (not poles) to bottom of both E strings is a must.
From that point you find your balance between pickups and then..you adjust pole position.
not the other way around. And yes thank you Paul Setzer, it would be good to have you around this place, your pickguards youve made me are fantastic!

 

[Mr Twangy]

This! Yes the pickup height is number one. The Gretsch Setup Guide says the pickup housings should be 3/32" on the treble side and 4/32" on the bass side. The TV Jones guide says 5/32" I think, but that's based on their TVJ pickups. 3/16" or 3/32", you need the pups pretty high. I'm running a clean amp and I can tell by my drive pedals: if the pups are too low the pedals sound flat and anemic.

 

[TV the Wired Turtle]

This! Yes the pickup height is number one. The Gretsch Setup Guide says the pickup housings should be 3/32" on the treble side and 4/32" on the bass side. The TV Jones guide says 5/32" I think, but that's based on their TVJ pickups. 3/16" or 3/32", you need the pups pretty high. I'm running a clean amp and I can tell by my drive pedals: if the pups are too low the pedals sound flat and anemic.

right which is why I cringe when I see some guy wrenchin the pole screws up off the bobbin like a half inch in the air trying to get the guitar to sound good. looks like corn sproutin in a garden

 

[ToneM1]

I wish I knew where Paul was! He use to send me stickers for HiLo’Trons.

 

[Viking Power]

Man, I needed this thread. I’ve realized that my setup has resulted in a mostly great guitar. I did well with intonation and got rid of some buzziness from the strings.
However, I have very little sustain and a spankiness that is almost farty especially the higher up the fretboard I get.
I am thinking at this point that I’ve got the pickups and poles all jacked up. Will review what I’ve read here and adjust.
Any further tips are appreciated.

 

[Powertennyman]

I think there is a guide / diagram / recommendations for setting pu and pole height for Filtertrons on the TV Jones website. What I do know is that Dynasonics and Filtertrons are both very sensitive to the height settings for both the pu body and pole pieces.

 

[Viking Power]

Ok, so…when measuring pickup height, do you leave the strings alone or do you hold them down at the last fret? Seems like there are differing schools of thought.